tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-701894736280253278.post8372689076388220357..comments2024-02-17T09:53:06.168+00:00Comments on Notes from the Slushpile: Concept, concept, concept – A publisher’s dream, a writer’s minefieldCandy Gourlayhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07802791643303335762noreply@blogger.comBlogger31125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-701894736280253278.post-18007508686617283632012-09-05T21:52:31.639+01:002012-09-05T21:52:31.639+01:00Yeah, it starts to hurt if you spend too long thin...Yeah, it starts to hurt if you spend too long thinking about it...! Jo Wytonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01941417444551495613noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-701894736280253278.post-18387076701762407202012-09-05T20:28:13.902+01:002012-09-05T20:28:13.902+01:00I have been musing over your post for days Jo! I a...I have been musing over your post for days Jo! I agree with SO MUCH (actually everything) of what you have to say. I think the difficulty is that in an extremely crowded market a debut author with a lovely/heart-warming/bitter-sweet/thoughtful/whatever book stands little chance of being a) picked up by an agent b) book being picked up by a publisher c) published book receiving any marketing/reviews/attention whatsoever.<br />See this post<br /> http://childrenspublishing.blogspot.com/2012/09/wow-wednesday-nikki-loftin-on-writing.html<br />Of course I really, really hope I'm wrong about all of the above...jongleusehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06754014776263314905noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-701894736280253278.post-86257117394944956772012-09-05T07:45:13.579+01:002012-09-05T07:45:13.579+01:00That's a really good way of thinking about it!...That's a really good way of thinking about it! Conceptual art - like it.Jo Wytonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01941417444551495613noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-701894736280253278.post-10851894626638549492012-09-04T18:56:34.861+01:002012-09-04T18:56:34.861+01:00I take your point there, that a high concept idea ...I take your point there, that a high concept idea is able to exist entirely separately to the story that's written around it. I'd also argue that a high concept has to be (relatively) unique to grab attention. This is much like conceptual art - the first person to execute an idea wins, almost regardless of how well they execute it.Nick Crosshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02571077124165351007noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-701894736280253278.post-6936738446324539882012-09-04T09:11:10.610+01:002012-09-04T09:11:10.610+01:00I love that tip about Will Smith / David Jason, Ma...I love that tip about Will Smith / David Jason, Maureen, :-). I'm writing a High Concept commission at the moment, aimed at 6-8s. It's a terrific idea and I'm sure the shops will swoop. All I can do is hope that my writing has enough about it to keep the ball rolling as the excitement of publication day fades. It must make commercial sense or the publishers wouldn't do it. Would they...? I like to hope that fast sell-in High Concept ideas are bankrolling the slow burners and keeping that flame of 'original but tough to sell' alive. <br /><br />PS My main character is definitely a Bruce Willis, despite being trapped in the body of an amusing animal much loved by 6-8s...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-701894736280253278.post-11266793787991487512012-09-04T08:54:10.582+01:002012-09-04T08:54:10.582+01:00Interesting post Jo, I still have very little know...Interesting post Jo, I still have very little knowledge on what all the publishing booky jargon actually means or what it implies. But I think your right concept on not its the strength of the characters and the writing that keeps you reading. Sallyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12759992873045228788noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-701894736280253278.post-28028143976402016712012-09-03T21:46:12.072+01:002012-09-03T21:46:12.072+01:00Doesn't high concept just mean the protagonist...Doesn't high concept just mean the protagonist might die a dreadful death?<br />Girl falls in love with a vampire - oh no she might die!<br />Boy wizard faces 'he who shall not be named' - oh no he might die!<br />Mouse fools Gruffalo - oh no, he might die!<br /><br />I attended a screenwriting course a few years ago and it was suggested that you think about the actor who would play your protagonist - if it was Will Smith or Bruce Willis then it was high concept. If it was David Jason, (who is brilliant) then it wasn't.Maureen Lynashttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16855138050232488108noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-701894736280253278.post-45794635678840491432012-09-03T20:59:47.903+01:002012-09-03T20:59:47.903+01:00Plus, it has an awesome cover. Not that I'm su...Plus, it has an awesome cover. Not that I'm superficial or anything. Nope. *pretty*Jo Wytonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01941417444551495613noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-701894736280253278.post-33302322043000082062012-09-03T20:46:09.813+01:002012-09-03T20:46:09.813+01:00I loved 'Flip' but bought it because I tho...I loved 'Flip' but bought it because I thought the character sounded really interesting. The concept didn't really filter through to me as something separate and astonishing, just a part of the brilliantly told story. This trumps everything.<br /><br />Thanks, Jo! <br /> Addy Farmerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00450583537731030466noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-701894736280253278.post-53592195739598215612012-09-03T18:52:48.721+01:002012-09-03T18:52:48.721+01:00Well that's certainly very true!! I think ever...Well that's certainly very true!! I think everyone has a slightly different definition. "Slated" could be the definition all by itself! Should have put that in the blog really, shouldn't I? I blame early morning blogging...Jo Wytonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01941417444551495613noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-701894736280253278.post-16899157530107105402012-09-03T18:27:56.311+01:002012-09-03T18:27:56.311+01:00...though I would say what is 'high concept......though I would say what is 'high concept' is subjective.Teri Terryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13641477543947472370noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-701894736280253278.post-716748482759105112012-09-03T18:21:57.306+01:002012-09-03T18:21:57.306+01:00Yes, most of your ideas are High Concept, Nick! An...Yes, most of your ideas are High Concept, Nick! And I love them all! <br /><br />But that's different to the pitch I guess. For example, "girl with cancer falls in love with boy who also has cancer" is nothing in itself, and yet The Fault In Our Stars is a perfect book, and sold big worldwide. It could never have been sold on concept alone - the brilliance is in the writing.Jo Wytonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01941417444551495613noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-701894736280253278.post-68768355828631514552012-09-03T18:19:11.153+01:002012-09-03T18:19:11.153+01:00I agree with you both, but I think there's a d...I agree with you both, but I think there's a difference between a USP and a High Concept idea. You're right, Teri - all books can have a USP, because it can be anything from writing style to characters to plot to setting to anything else you can think of. But High Concept is different - a High Concept idea is capable of selling on the idea alone, because it's plot-driven, and not about the execution. At least that's what it seems to me, anyway!Jo Wytonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01941417444551495613noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-701894736280253278.post-2849435664831673262012-09-03T15:42:31.665+01:002012-09-03T15:42:31.665+01:00I have to say that I've found that high concep...I have to say that I've found that high concept is great for pitching and getting agents to ask for a submission, but then you're down to whether they like the writing. So you only really jump one hurdle, although I guess it would make life easier if you finally get to the acquisitions stage.Nick Crosshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02571077124165351007noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-701894736280253278.post-65354588706556479302012-09-03T15:28:00.232+01:002012-09-03T15:28:00.232+01:00I loved Numbers! To be honest, I think you should...I loved Numbers! To be honest, I think you should write your book, then think of the high concept - along with a great one line pitch. Anything that'll get it noticed really! Then, as Jo says, it's down to the writing. Jackie Marchanthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12567038737470422449noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-701894736280253278.post-84237127319507564202012-09-03T15:24:38.862+01:002012-09-03T15:24:38.862+01:00It took me ages to understand 'High Concept...It took me ages to understand 'High Concept'. Probably because my ideas weren't! But now it's such a fundamental component in my ideas antenna I find that my new projects are naturally high concept. Haven't sold any of them yet though. Jo Franklinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11863749932391225653noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-701894736280253278.post-50987840622400737132012-09-03T14:58:27.195+01:002012-09-03T14:58:27.195+01:00I think I'm yet to have one of these! LOL! Oh ...I think I'm yet to have one of these! LOL! Oh dear! Take care<br />xOld Kittyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13185547869183611159noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-701894736280253278.post-9921934600032919972012-09-03T14:34:49.134+01:002012-09-03T14:34:49.134+01:00Aw, thanks, Vanessa and Jo. I wish I could tell yo...Aw, thanks, Vanessa and Jo. I wish I could tell you what the next one's about, but I haven't got a sufficiently pithy pitch yet. I love Teri Terry's reference to 'Die Hard with Fairies' for Artemis Fowl (see comment below). That's priceless.Rachel Wardhttp://www.rachelwardbooks.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-701894736280253278.post-66426218365820906302012-09-03T14:05:25.038+01:002012-09-03T14:05:25.038+01:00'What Kate said': pretty much exactly what...'What Kate said': pretty much exactly what I was thinking.<br /><br />And I'll add.... as a reader, as soon as I heard 'Die Hard with fairies' I HAD to read Artemis Fowl. And no doubt if I'd written it (in my dreams...!) and someone had asked me what it was about, I'd have rambled on and on - it needed Die Hard with Fairies for me to want to read it.<br /><br />I personally think any novel that is GOOD (for whatever reason it is good) - there will be a way to say why, in a line or two, like that, that sums up its USP.<br /><br />For my part I'm getting better at summing things up (though I still ramble), but this is marketing-speak to me, no matter how brilliant and essential it eventually is, and not something I want or need to worry about much (if at all) when I'm writing.Teri Terryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13641477543947472370noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-701894736280253278.post-24754855207458899572012-09-03T13:58:55.562+01:002012-09-03T13:58:55.562+01:00Having been through high concept and out the other...Having been through high concept and out the other side, I agree that it can be a case of the tail wagging the dog as the concept takes centre-stage to the expense of the story. But it can also be kind-of cool to write and to read.<br /><br />Alternatively, I'd argue that you can boil down any story to a pitch AFTER you've written it and come up with a concept that marketing can latch onto. I think most coherent stories can be summarised in a couple of sentences and if they can't, then perhaps what you've done is too complicated anyway? But I guess I'm the kind of writer who strives for simplicity and others' results may vary.<br /><br />Nick.Nick Crosshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02571077124165351007noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-701894736280253278.post-92152261280194119082012-09-03T13:57:27.576+01:002012-09-03T13:57:27.576+01:00This comment has been removed by the author.Nick Crosshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02571077124165351007noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-701894736280253278.post-70107825468083210972012-09-03T13:20:19.726+01:002012-09-03T13:20:19.726+01:00Fascinating, Jo, and also the earlier piece. I thi...Fascinating, Jo, and also the earlier piece. I think the point about High Concept is that it makes it so much easier to market - both for an agent to market to a publisher, then for a publisher's sales force to market to shops etc. But if it's Concept alone, without an emotional core to the story plus characters you care about, it's not going to be a satisfying read.<br /><br />As a reader, I do want to read something I haven't read before - not necessarily a far out concept, but certainly something fresh and original (another agent/publisher cliche but one that means something too).<br /><br />Maybe a better way to think about it, if we have to think in marketing terms at all (which certainly shouldn't dominate the writing process but can be helpful when planning and pitching), is of Unique Selling Points. So what makes the book stand out from the crowd - might be the concept or then again it might be the intensity of a love story, the viewpoint of the story-telling (the alien not the human) or the subject it looks at. I'm more comfortable with USP because what makes the book stand out can be as simple as wonderful writing that can be sign-posted, say, in the blurb on the back. So as writers we can think: THIS is what made me want to tell this story, and it's my particular interests and passions that makes it different. <br /><br />Slightly rambling, hope that makes some sense. Kate Harrisonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18344353468176988063noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-701894736280253278.post-26302941019675225552012-09-03T12:24:21.608+01:002012-09-03T12:24:21.608+01:00Thanks, Donna! Thing is, books that aren't ...Thanks, Donna! Thing is, books that aren't 'High Concept' are published all the time, so if it's well written and a good story, I hold out hope that it will ring *somebody's* bell! Jo Wytonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01941417444551495613noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-701894736280253278.post-62178453461077855502012-09-03T12:21:21.099+01:002012-09-03T12:21:21.099+01:00I know exactly what you mean! I have also tried to...I know exactly what you mean! I have also tried to write High Concept books, and I find I run out of steam very quickly, because it isn't the characters or the writing that is exciting me, it's the idea, and I find I just can't write books that way. I don't think sticking to the idea is a failure, though. I guess you just have to be careful that the idea doesn't rule the roost.Jo Wytonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01941417444551495613noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-701894736280253278.post-10262929884117147012012-09-03T12:18:50.698+01:002012-09-03T12:18:50.698+01:00Thanks! It can be a struggle to stick to your guns...Thanks! It can be a struggle to stick to your guns I think, especially when you're watching High Concept stuff sweep the bestseller lists.Jo Wytonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01941417444551495613noreply@blogger.com